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What are you watching right now? Why? (please read 1st post)


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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23754
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 11:50 am Reply with quote
Ignatz wrote:
How come Hyouge Mono is so unpopular?


Quote:
It didn't even answer its own fundamental question, something which it had mulled over for almost the entire thirty-nine-episode run.


Quote:
It has its flaws.


Quote:
It seems to lack the touch of greatness, and I never got chills down my spine from watching it.


Quote:
When examined individually, most components are merely adequate, some even less so.


Quote:
It is impossible to find specific scenes which showcase its greatness.


Geez, and he thought it was a Masterpiece. Can you imagine what'd he'd be saying if he hated it? Laughing
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Ggultra2764
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Joined: 21 Jan 2004
Posts: 3872
Location: New York state.
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:01 pm Reply with quote
Started up on Hyouge Mono earlier in the week. I have been wanting to see the series for two years now, though I've had to wait out on it obviously due to the slow release of fansubbed episodes. I'm currently on episode 22 of the series and loving every minute of it. The discussion of feudal era politics and the exaggerated commitment that Furuta Sasuke has to tea ceremonies and aesthetics is quite the delight for me and allows the series to stick out quite a bit from more conventional titles, especially since I'm a sap for historical titles such as this. Obviously, the series won't be for everyone considering its unconventional storytelling and heavy focus on Japan's traditional roots. But thus far, I'm loving what this series is doing for me.
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dtm42



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 14084
Location: currently stalking my waifu
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:22 pm Reply with quote
Glad you're liking the show so far, Ggultra2764.

errinundra wrote:


That image (and/or the one that came right before it) is going to be an Avatar of mine. When I was watching the final episode last night I used MPC to save numerous screencaps, and that was definitely one of them. No way I'd overlook such a striking image with such powerful symbolism.

Ignatz wrote:
How come Hyouge Mono is so unpopular?


Because it's a weird low-budget show about samurai men who barely fight and instead spend their days doing things like talking, serving tea, drinking tea, worshipping tea, orgasming over tea accessories, making bizarre and contorted expressions, and, of course, more talking. And more tea.

People these days just want busty girls with brightly-coloured hair - wearing outfits with less surface area than a tea-towel - fighting one another in ways that make the already skimpy clothes threaten to disappear. In other words, the complete opposite of Hyouge Mono.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23754
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:02 pm Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
Ignatz wrote:
How come Hyouge Mono is so unpopular?


Because it's a weird low-budget show about samurai men who barely fight and instead spend their days doing things like talking, serving tea, drinking tea, worshipping tea, orgasming over tea accessories, making bizarre and contorted expressions, and, of course, more talking. And more tea.

People these days just want busty girls with brightly-coloured hair - wearing outfits with less surface area than a tea-towel - fighting one another in ways that make the already skimpy clothes threaten to disappear. In other words, the complete opposite of Hyouge Mono.


There's logic at it's finest. Aren't grooving on a show where samurai talk and orgasm over tea accessories? Well then clearly you're only interested in busty girls with brightly-coloured hair. Laughing
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Mr. Oshawott



Joined: 12 Mar 2012
Posts: 6773
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:46 pm Reply with quote
Not too long ago I started watched Agent Aika. Although the small show was laden with fanservice, I found myself enjoying it somewhat. I liked the scene in which spoiler[Aika's alter ego demonstrated her massive power with her tentacle-like attacks while fighting against her attackers.]
While I wouldn't recommend this show for those that can't handle controversial material all that well, I think Agent Aika is a good show for those seeking a quick adventure with some fanservice mixed right into it.
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Knoepfchen



Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 698
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:04 pm Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
Because it's a weird low-budget show about samurai men who barely fight and instead spend their days doing things like talking, serving tea, drinking tea, worshipping tea, orgasming over tea accessories, making bizarre and contorted expressions, and, of course, more talking. And more tea.


I can say without the slightest hint of irony that this sounds quite intriguing. With only 19 (and very varied) ratings given in the encyclopedia, I might never have checked this out. Now I definitely will.
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dtm42



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 14084
Location: currently stalking my waifu
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:38 pm Reply with quote
^
It is a very strange show in almost every way. All they do is talk talk talk, and yet I was left hanging off every word. What they're saying is - superficially-speaking - not all that interesting. It's how they're saying it and what the underlying message is that are important.

Although the tea ceremony seems to be the focus of the show, the truth is that the ceremony was only a facilitator. The most powerful men in the land - the feudal lords - invite one another to tea ceremonies to 'talk shop' and run the country. The close confines of the tea room is where the real discussions and deals are made, where allies reaffirm commitment to one another, and where rivals/enemies take the chance to size one another up and probe for weaknesses.

In the show, many of the lords were swept up by this philosophical movement of wabi-suki (which did exist in real life under the name wabi-cha). Translated as "imperfection", the term basically meant to appreciate the beauty of the humble, to live in close harmony with your surroundings, and to only use what you need and nothing more than that. It also strongly implied a rejection of (then-superior) foreign goods and foreign ideas, and to focus on Japanese culture and wares. This is why the men went practically gaga over teapots and lids and stirring spoons, because such things represented their ideals and encapsulated their worldview.

To be proficient in tea ceremony was practically expected if an ambitious samurai wished to be seen as a cultured lord rather than a brutish general, and so those who were good at it were highly regarded and rewarded. Wabi-suki is a very layered and complex philosophy that had great bearing on how the characters lived their lives (and how the daimyo in real life lived theirs). So yes, superficially it is a show where characters talk and drink tea. But look beneath the surface and you see that there is a heck of a lot going on.
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victor viper



Joined: 18 Jun 2011
Posts: 630
Location: The deep south
PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 8:56 pm Reply with quote
My Railgun DVD's finally got here, and, I decided to sample the dub of the first couple of episodes. The dub is not bad; in particular, Alison Vikorin does a pretty good job as Kuroko. I did, however, notice a few odd things about the dub.

The dub uses "sissy" as a translation for "onee-sama"; it sounds a little bit awkward, but I can't complain since I can't really think of a better alternative, especially given Kuroko's distinctive manner of speech. And, the inflection on some of the names ("Misaka" in particular) doesn't quite sound right. In addition, this could just be me being picky, but Ruiko's VA sounds way too old for the character.

Overall though, the dub was passable and I might watch a few more episodes dubbed while I catch up on the show.
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Errinundra
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:14 pm Reply with quote
Hyouge Mono episoses 26-39

Reason for watching: Because the first 25 episodes (previous reviews here and here) proved Hyouge Mono to be unlike any other anime I've ever seen. It is also the most interesting and most layered anime I've ever seen. And, finally, it's the only anime whose primary target audience is old farts like me.

Synopsis: In the wake of the great Kitano Tea Ceremony Hechikan has forced tea master Rikyu to admit to himself the monstrosities he has committed in pursuit of his ideals, while he, in turn, has made Furuta realise that he (Furuta) is an imitator and a fake. Toyotomi, now the most powerful man in Japan, sets about subduing the last resisting Daimyo - principally the Hojo and Date clans - as a prelude to invading Korea, China and perhaps even India. His power depends on the support of many Daimyo, not the least of whom is Tokugawa, whose straightforward intelligence and honesty set him apart from his rivals. Toyotami's baleful lieutenant, Ishida, seeking to destroy the influence of Rikyu and the other aesthetes, incites Toyotami to behead one of the tea master's proteges. This, along with information from Tokugawa about the truth of events after the assassination at Honnoji Temple, brings home to Rikyu the folly and failure of his ambitions and the terrible errors he has made in promoting Toyotomi's rise. Changing his allegiance, he begins to plot the downfall of the emperor's "Chief Advisor". Meanwhile Furuta finds himself with a dilemma. His pursuit of his aesthetic ideals can only be financed by his role as a warrior under Toyotomi even though the two notions are frequently at odds. This contradiction comes to a dreadful climax when Toyotomi orders Furuta to betray his cherished ideals in the most horrifying way imaginable.



Warning. Somewhat spoilerific. All the characters are based on real life people. Note that the events of the series only cover the period 1577 to 1591. My short descriptions below cover their lives more generally. The background is the warring states period. In the earlier episodes, the dominant daimyo Oda Nobunaga had been betrayed at Honnoji Temple (history blames his General Akechi while Hyouge Mono fingers Toyotomi acting under the encouragement of Rikyu) enabling Toyotami to take his place as the most powerful warlord in Japan.

Top row (L-R):

Furuta Oribe (1544 – 1615): Retainer and warrior for both Oda Nobunaga and Toyotomi Hideyoshi, he would go on to become the most influential tea master after the death of his mentor, Sen no Rikyu. He also introduced a new, bold style of pottery that became much prized and imitated, even to this day. Many years after the events of the series he found himself in a compromising political situation and was forced to commit seppuku by the second Tokugawa shogun. In the series he is an obsessive aesthete struggling to find his own creative voice. He is also a cunning negotiator. Where his peers win castles through bloody battle, he wins them through bluff, cajolery and sheer chutzpah.

Date Masamune (1567 – 1636): Rascally warlord who initially resisted Toyotomi but was eventually convinced to support him. A brilliant strategist, he served under both Toyotomi and later under the Tokugawa shogunate. In the series Furuta twice saves his skin by convincing him to perform outrageous acts of public humiliation.

Toyotomi Hideyoshi (1536 – 1598): The second of the three great unifiers of Japan (between Oda Nobunaga and Tokugawa Ieyasu) toward the end of the warring states period. After the events of the series he went on to unsuccessfully invade Korea. Upon his death his surviving son, Hideyori, was still underage, leaving a power vacuum in Japan.

Middle row:

Tokugawa Ieyasu (1543 – 1616): Founded Edo (depicted in the series and later to become Tokyo). Although he supported Toyotomi his ambitions could no longer be constrained after Toyotomi's death. He eventually became shogun and completed the unification of Japan. The series portrays him as honest, simple in taste and, perhaps a little ironically, driven by a desire to bring peace and prosperity to the war torn country.

Sen no Rikyu (1522 – 1591): At the centre of all the machinations of Hyouge Mono he was the tea master to both Oda Nobunaga and Toyotami Hideyoshi. An adherent of the principle of wabi-cha - simplicity, honesty and directness - he was to become the inspiration and fountainhead for all the main Japanese tea ceremony schools. These episodes depict his falling out with Toyotomi and their terrible consequences.

Chacha (1569 – 1615): Niece of Oda Nobunaga, concubine - then later wife - of Toyotomi, and mother of his heir, Hideyori. When Tokugawa became shogun, she and Hideyori committed suicide.

Bottom row

Yamanoue Soji (1544 – 1590): Protoge of Sen no Rikyu whose writings on the tea ceremony fell into the hands of Ishida Mitsunari, giving the latter a pretext to persecute the aesthetes.

Ishida Mitsunari (1559 – 1600): Talented but unpopular samurai and bureaucrat in the Toyotami government, known for his rigid behaviour. After the death of Toyotami he effectively controlled the government. He drove the daimyo into an alliance with Tokugawa who defeated him in the Battle of Sekigahara. Following the battle he was captured by villagers and beheaded. In the series he is the implacable enemy of the aesthetes.

Hojo Ujinao (1562 – 1591): The last leader of the Hojo clan. The series depicts the siege of his castle at Odawara by Tokugawa under the overall authority of Toyotomi. After the siege his father and uncle were forced to commit seppuku but, being married to Tokugawa's daughter, he was released into exile where he died.

***

In episode 28 Tokugawa introduces Furuta to his ten year old son and asks the aesthete to school his son in the ways of the capital, Kyoto. Furuta initially addresses the young man by his given name but is corrected - the Chief Advisor Toyotomi had given him the new name Hidetada. When Furuta compliments the young man on this warlike sounding name, Hidetada ignores him. The camera first lingers on the nonchalantly eating young man then on Furuta's puzzled face. Furuta then offers Hidetada two wooden tea scoops, directing him to choose one after giving it some consideration. One scoop has a lump in the handle caused by a knot in the wood, while the other is flawless. To the aesthete the knotted scoop represents the ideal of imperfection. As Furuta leaves we see the young man diligently practising his sword techniques. We also see that he has broken the knotted scoop in half.

The scene is a good example of how Hyouge Mono works. Don't forget that the series is directed by Koichi Mashimo with a script by Hiroyuki Kawasaki, whose collaborations are notable for their po-faced irony. With the utmost economy, a number of important things are established here. On the surface, the discussion seems mundane - a simple transaction between a father and mentor concerning the education of a young man expected to become a future leader. The words as translated in the fansub don't seem particularly witty nor is there any apparent hidden meaning to them. Oh, but the scene is replete with undercurrents. Furuta is pursuing the ideal of imperfection - wabi-cha - that authenticity in life acknowledges that nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect. The knotted scoop represents this aesthetic notion. The young warrior and future shogun represents an entirely different perspective - simplicity. The scoop and the sword are each a means to an end and no more. Anything else is pretense. The broken scoop signifies the young man's complete rejection of Furuta's world view. Or, to look at it another way, Tokugawa Snr and Togukawa Jnr have an innate grasp of wabi-cha that is eluding both Rikyu and Furuta.

But there's even more going on here. The uncomfortable moment when Hidetada ignores Furuta had me wondering whether something I didn't know about was being hinted at here. To top of it off, the swinging sword and broken scoop gave the scene an ominous tone that had me curious. Afterwards I checked out what happened to Furuta and Hidetada and learned that, some 26 years after this scene, Tokugawa Hidetada, second shogun of the Tokugawa dynasty will order Furuta to commit seppuku. In this scene not only do we get a general illustration of the clash between aesthetic and martial values but we get a particular hint at the tragedy awaiting Furuta, even if that fate awaiting him doesn't take place until many years after the events of Hyouge Mono.

At its core, Hyouge Mono is high tragedy in the classical Japanese or Greek or Shakespearean sense. At the centre of the tragedy is Sen no Rikyu, the classical tragic hero, whose flaw - hubris - leads him to destruction. The point of view character, Furuta, is a variation on the theme. While he isn't destroyed by his flaws, the death sentence given to Rikyu, whom he idolises as his hero, is his moment of crisis. The term crisis is Greek and in classical Greek tragedy it is the moment when the events of the narrative present the character with a choice of paths to take. In tragedy the hero chooses the wrong path. In comedy the hero choses the correct path. (In Greek theatre a tragedy was simply a play with an unhappy ending while a comedy was a play with a happy ending. That distinction has long since changed in the English language. By the way, Koichi Mashimo has far more western influences in his anime than most, if not all, other anime directors.) For his part, Rikyu's crisis arrives when he is ordered to give his adopted daughter and his prized tea kettle to Toyotomi. Much of the power and poignancy of these crises for the two main characters comes because they are preceded by moments of clarity where Rikyu and Furuta reach new levels of self-awareness that give them a degree of contentment hitherto eluding them.

(On another level the series could be seen as the tale of one aesthetic style, Furuta's flamboyant Oribe-yaki, superseding Rikyu's older, more austere, style of Raku-yaki. But that's Hyouge Mono for you: layer upon layer upon layer.)

Over 39 episodes, there is scene after scene like the one with Furuta and Hidetada, where characters talk and interact on one level but so much is happening under the surface. Two characters may seem to be discussing the decorations of the room while they sip tea but in reality it is code for how one wants the other to make a political or military move against a third character. It may be one person making a pointed commentary on the character of the other. Part of the genius of the series is that once the viewer has sorted out who is who and their significance in the historical context (admittedly that requires some effort but the rewards will come) then the subtext and the double meanings are quite clear. And the stakes are very high. We are talking politics, war, assassination, seppuku and beheadings. Serving a dish of pineapple and cream can be a pre-meditated insult from one daimyo to another. Putting a statue in a temple can lead to seppuku. Under all the talking and all the argy-bargy is an undercurrent of extreme violence. This is the warring states period, after all.

In the same way that dtm42's description of Hyouge Mono being nothing but talking heads undersells the series (although he is being intentionally ironic in true Mashimo style) then Lynzee Lamb's description of it in The List as "historical comedy" also misses the point. For sure, the series can be funny but it isn't comedy for its own sake; the jokes aren't just there for the laughs. The style of comedy is absurdity and it is working largely in the service of tragedy. It's not inserted just to soften the tragedy (which it does) nor is it simply there for ironic effect (though it is highly ironic) but it represents the fatalistic side of tragedy: that all our effort is ultimately in vain. Another classic absurd tragedy, Barry Lyndon, ends with the wonderful line, "It was in the reign of George III that the above-named personages lived and quarrelled; good or bad, handsome or ugly, rich or poor, they are all equal now." That is, they are all dead. You could replace George III with Toyotomi Hideyoshi and it could be a perfect final line for Hyouge Mono. Mind you, where Barry Lyndon kind of peters out, Hyouge Mono ends with shattering power - one of the best ever endings in anime (even if Mashimo and Kawasaki still can't resist throwing the odd gag in). Furuta Oribe has faced his crisis and will flourish for the next 20 years or more and leave a lasting impact on Japanese culture. For him, the moment is both appalling and liberating.

If the preceding episodes (15-25) had emphasised the comic side of Hyouge Mono (and lacked the impact of earlier and later episodes) then these last magnificent episodes return to the waging of war and the naked use of power in a violent era. By presenting the political manouvering through the filter of the aesthetics of the tea ceremony we get a commentary on both - we see how pretentious and ultimately pointless they both are. If the absurdity here is in the service of tragedy then both are in the service of satire. A kind of intellectual enso, you might say. For satire to work there must be an overt or implied alternative to the subject of the satire. If you are poking fun at something there must be a moral alternative or it remains mere sarcasm, a la Katsuhiro Otomo. In Hyouge Mono that alternative appears in the ideals of justice as voiced by General Akechi and in Tokugawa Ieyasu's dream of building the city of justice (that will, in time, become Tokyo). I have to admit that the Edo building scenes with Tokugawa staring heroically into the distance after toiling side by side with his workers in the finest Soviet statuary tradition got a tad hammy. The stirring, sentimental string music emphasised the cheesiness, which had me suspecting that Mashimo was doing one of his habitual leg pulls. Nevertheless, continuing on the Greek tragedy theme, this yearning for justice amidst violence parallels the journey from revenge to justice in Aeschylus's The Oresteia. Yes, Hyouge Mono is that ambitious. I keep telling you, this is no ordinary anime.

Hyouge Mono has the perfect director in Koichi Mashimo. It is as if he were born to direct this series. Not since The Irresponsible Captain Tylor in the early 90s has his penchant for absurdity been given such free rein. He has the ability to be simultaneously po-faced, over the top, and yet profound. Sure there are the expected Mashimo lapses of judgement and times where I feel I'm just not getting the point but there are none of the times where it seems he's just going through the motions so evident in El Cazador de la Bruja or the latter parts of Phantom ~ Requiem for the Phantom. For the first time since Noir it feels as if he is fully committed to the project. Like Noir and Phantom there is a powerful redemptive element to Hyouge Mono for, despite the terrible climax, the series ends on a hopeful note. Furuta knows what he is, what he must do to be what he is, and how he fits into the wider scheme of things. The long night of horror gives way to a new dawn as Osen, his wife, watches two birds of prey circling above. One bird is caught silhouetted by the sun and the anime transforms the image into a beautiful enso painted on pottery in the Oribe-yaki style. Furuta Oribe has found his true voice. Two of the episodes of Mashimo's Blade of the Immortal contain similar stories about artists trying to find their artistic voice. In Hyouge Mono Mashimo has found his.



Rating: masterpiece.


Last edited by Errinundra on Wed Nov 08, 2017 11:53 pm; edited 7 times in total
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zawa113



Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 7357
PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 6:43 am Reply with quote
^Hmm, perhaps I shall check out Hyouge Mono when I have the chance. I've heard descriptions of people who should be doing badass things, but are sitting around talking about tea, and that somehow appeals to me (probably because Cromartie High School was about badasses who never fought and instead did stupid things and sat around and talked. And all looked like they were in their 30s instead of high school, punctuated with Masked Takenouchi and Freddie Mercury not being questioned on their age. And I adore the hell out of Cromartie High School for sure!)

Anyway, on to what I watched. I was unaware that the classic old dub line "No go! Before I throw 'ya down on the ground and rape 'ya!" was from Orguss 02. Sure, I'd seen the clip on youtube before, but that doesn't mean I remembered what it was from. Also, most weird old dub lines come terrible things, like Mad Bull 34, but Orguss 02 was pretty good.
First off, no connections to original Orguss show up until the very last seconds of episode 3. From there, yeah, lots of refs to original Orguss, but I'm still not entirely sure how much a new viewer would need to know about original Orguss. For starters though, it totally spoils the ending of original Orguss! Though we do get to see what happens to a few characters after the original too. It also mentions two characters' with a spoiler there. I do feel that it explains everything you need to of the original, to me, it was just reminding me what they wanted to know what was important here, for others, it could definitely feel like a vaguely confusing info dump. That said, I don't think the connections were total bs just to connect it to Orguss, it did make sense with the overall mecha fightings going on.
But what I enjoyed was all the political shadiness going on in the background. And I think it spent the most time on that, which is a good thing because it was fun! Certain things showed up that reminded me of Legend of the Galactic Heroes and Princess Knight. In the case of LoGH, a creepy thing for sure, and that trope is always creepy without fail whenever it's used is the good thing. And people don't tend to just throw the trope around either, another good thing about it.
The other main plot it the main boy and the main love interest girl, and while the political dealings are far more interesting, I liked the chemistry between these two and they were interesting to watch. Clearly the most interesting character was still "Throw ya down on the ground and rape ya!" Manning, one of those characters whose alliances aren't clear at all times and is generally a nice guy who seems to enjoy doing strange things. Reminded me a bit of the blond from Armor Hunter Mellowlink (except in Mellowlink spoiler[that guy definitely ended up being the bad guy and it was awesome]). In original Orguss, the womanizer was the main character himself, but this time it's Manning, and it definitely works better on a side character who is already awesome because it definitely made Kei Katsuragi hard to like at first.
Overall, I enjoyed it. It's not as good as other older OVAs like Macross Plus, but compared to all the Mad Bull 34 junk Manga Ent released back in the VHS era, this would've been a definite winner. I recommend it to people who want the fantasy politics with a healthy side of action.
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gridsleep





PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:32 pm Reply with quote
No. 6. Don't know why. Seem to be on a failure of the utopia kick. There do seem to be a lot of those. I think the mangaka are fixated on it for some reason. Maybe they're afraid they're going to be deported to Singapore.
As far as No. 6 is concerned, have you read Ursula leGuin's story 'The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas'? Same thing.
And I just remembered No. 6 was the prisoner. dunkduhDUNK dunkduhDUNK dunkduhDUNK dunkduhDUNK DOOT dah DOOOOOH DOOT dah DOOOOOOH DOO DOO doo doo doo. Twang twang twang twang twang twang toong twanga twang...
Be seeing you! 6
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zawa113



Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 7357
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:32 pm Reply with quote
I watched my Digimon 02 set, yay! I then went back and looked some of JO's views on it. Definitely all valid, and yet it's still an absurdly fun show anyway. Even if Davis sucks. And they had to retcon the hell out of the first Digimon series. I'm not a huge fan of retconning, it rarely seems to work out well (clearly Legend of Zelda is the biggest retconning nightmare in existence though. Wait, I change my mind! Kingdom Hearts.)
The insert fight songs are definitely better this time around, probably because they could choose from three, all of which sounded significantly better than "Hey, Digimon!", and they've got a 90s music charm to them. Reminds me that sometimes I find songs charming because they're just trying to be so stereotypical of their era and damn if they're not succeeding.
But yeah, I've found it interesting to see how my opinions have changed over the year. I definitely preferred Adventure 1, because it definitely spent more time on the characters. Ken and Oikawa clearly got the lion's share this time around, while in Adventure 1, everyone got a good share. Maybe not Mimi, she didn't have a whole lot wrong in the first place. Then again, most of us didn't give a damn about Mimi anyway. Speaking of which, I liked her a ton better in 02, I wish she had been more like that in 1.
I rather do wish that the Dark Ocean got more time, because there was a Digimon Cthulhu, man! My other problem was that they referenced the Wonder Swan games, and I had to go online and see wtf was up. The Wonder Swan never came out here, man! The first series never referenced it and made me go online and learn things! I liked how it was all so self contained! And when this first came out when I was a kid, this info wouldn't have been online anyway! I'm sure there's fan translations for the full games out there at this point though. Doesn't mean I have time to play 4 full games. Of course, this problem will persist into Tamers when Ryo shows up like he's a main character who gets to be in all the awesome battles and get all the neat evolutions everyone else gets and I remember that always confused the hell out of me as a kid, making me go "Wait, who is this? Why is he important?" which is totally beyond unfair to any kid outside of Japan. So yeah, for whenever I get the season 3 set, we'll just pretend I've addressed this problem.
But yeah, even despite all the ball dropping on the plot and the characters (of the new kids, Cody probably got the most development, though nothing can compare to the character ball dropping of Frontier where it just pretended half the characters didn't exist after a certain point, but I still hope that comes out so I can buy it too), it's still just so damn much fun! Not as good as the original, which I'll probably visit more, but it so makes me smile to watch it anyway! Probably the most high energy of the Digimon series I've seen (1-4) imo, which is probably makes forgiving all of its incredible flaws rather forgiving because it is damn entertaining.
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CrowLia



Joined: 24 Feb 2012
Posts: 5504
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 12:00 am Reply with quote
I've been watching Kurau: Phantom Memory recently, I'm currently up to episode 8. This series came to my hands with a high recommendation level from my brother, who told me it made a fantastic portrayal of a lesbian relationship, and my interest in it spiked when Ayaka Steiger was nominated for the Most Improved tournament, with very good arguments in her favor.

Sadly, I'm feeling underwhelmed by the series. The first episode was fantastic and the concept of the original Kurau being replaced by the Ryna Sapiens, who apparently comes to identify herself with Kurau is very intriguing. Kurau's emphasis on protecting her body for she must give it back to Dr. Amami and the real Kurau at some point stroke me as very meaningful and touching. But from episode two onwards the series has seemed to lack overall direction, it's all over the place. One moment, Kurau is using her Rynax powers to save a man from space, then she's running away from the GPO, then she's playing family with Christmas, then she's acting a maid in a random cafe, all the while Rynax powers are flying all over the place to random people, to Christmas, back to Kurau, exploding and all of this for reasons I don't quite understand other than "must not get caught by GPO".

The relationship between Kurau and Christmas has underwhelmed me as well. For a pair that won the "Best Duo" tournament here, their interactions, as far as I've seen, seem to replicate the standard Japanese marriage/couple routine, except for the fact that they're both girls. One of them -Kurau, the more masculine- goes to work all day, fights big fights and brings food to the table. The other -Christmas, the petite feminine one- stays home all day waiting for Kurau to come back, making food for her, and occassionally going out shopping. Like I said, this is the typical life of any Japanese marriage and nothing about it struck me as original or unique. For all I knew, Kurau could have been a man and it would've been all the same.

I'm going to keep watching because I find it hard to believe that this show, that so far has been nothing but confusing and generic, has earned so much unanimous praise, so I hope it gets better later, but as it is now, I hardly even look forward to the next episode. It's not bad, I just feel disappointed that, for all the hype around it, there's been nothing even remotely memorable about it, except for the first episode.

Also, everytime Christmas breaks into calling Kurau's name as a mantra, fifteen times in a row, I want to stab her and her squeaky annoying little voice.
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dtm42



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 14084
Location: currently stalking my waifu
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:13 am Reply with quote
CrowLia wrote:
I've been watching Kurau: Phantom Memory recently, I'm currently up to episode 8. This series came to my hands with a high recommendation level from my brother, who told me it made a fantastic portrayal of a lesbian relationship...


Ahahahahahahaha.

I applaud your brother's wickedness.

You got trolled good.
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Mr. Oshawott



Joined: 12 Mar 2012
Posts: 6773
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 6:04 am Reply with quote
I'm currently watching Cyber Team in Akihabara. A girl named Hibari Hanakoganei befriends a small, cute mechanical creature called a PataPi, who she names Densuke. So far, I'm enjoying the first few episodes of the show. I think CTiA is awesome for those that enjoy action scenes while relishing the moe theme.

Last edited by Mr. Oshawott on Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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